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I'm bored. : (
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Author:  Rylius [ 09.29.09 ]
Post subject:  I'm bored. : (
Yay finally I managed to get NetRadiant working!

My "project" is someway ut4_tower, which is basically a big tower. In the center the players spawn and then there are secret rooms with doors and jumppads and stuff, but this is IMPOSSIBLE to play on Team-Games.
(I know sounds like crap, which this basically is.)

Ehm yeah but now I think I learned enough to start a "real" map.
Problem is, I dont know what should be in there :|
So pl0x help me! :D
Any idea is appreciated, but I just want to have something to do ;)
Author:  SvaRoX [ 09.29.09 ]
Post subject:  Re: I'm bored. : (
What about a collaborative map designing ? There is an utility allowing map creators to design parts of the map separately and assemble them for compiling.

In fact I thought about a kind of challenge to motivate myself some times ago : dividing a map in 2 parts, each one designing his own part, the objective being to create the most campers-friendly place :)
I know "camping is bad", but imagine something like riyadh : two facing buildings, lots of windows or walls to hide and train SR8 or G36... For those who want to rush, the middle could be protected from snipers fire, for example a place under the ground full of corridors and boxes to allow close-combat only. So it would give a well-balanced map, and it could be big enough to host 45 players...
What do you think ? :)
Author:  SteveMcqueen [ 09.29.09 ]
Post subject:  Re: I'm bored. : (
that wont work, i bet. sorry svarox :>

there is a whole lot more to a "good" map. no matter what game, no matter gametype, there are always some no-go things. two of them might correspond to what you just suggested svarox.

- fort building style. placing two houses against each other makes for too many positions from where you can be shot. it is just roulette where an enemy will pop up and if you get him in time.
- box maps. just making a big box and filling it will usually not be too great.
for example, granja or terrorism is box style.

framerate will not be too good when designing stuff like this. also scaling (wrong scale = doors with 4,5 meters wide and 10 meters high) will very likely be fucked.

also a sign of a good mapper is avoiding mapping symmetrical maps.

algiers is top. on tombs you tend to be lost. why?

to better canalize the discussing, name some maps you consider to be 'good'. and then let us brainstorm why they could be? deal? ;)

p.s.
first maps are always crap. mapping is learning-by-doing. and that process NEVER ends.
a wonder train is as ok as it is. considering i never mapped before it, it is kinda the exception that proves the rule.
Author:  SvaRoX [ 09.29.09 ]
Post subject:  Re: I'm bored. : (
Yeah I see what you mean about good maps, it's not about putting some boxes and walls... But anyway this is not to create a legendary map, just fun map, I hope all-round for most style of play.
About good maps : there are maps fun to play (IMO) but not good technically speaking (and strategically speaking...). Take arena2 for example : mostly basic textures and 3D, (symmetric ?), but still fun to play. Ok I couldn't play 2 hours non-stop on this map...
Same for dealey plazza, I find it fun to play (I know you don't :p), even if it's not a great map.
About symmetrical map, take ryiadh for example. For a long time I thought riyadh wasn't symmetric but finally I think it is, even if there are probably small differences between the sides (mainly global lighting I would say). And you have 2 facing buildings : I still love this map after hundreds of rounds spent on it.
I don't know if you ever played UT, but if it's the case, remember the CTF maps facing worlds and facing worlds 2 : greeeeeattt maps, not so complicated but so cool to play. Ok it was UT, a bit different, with x10 zoom snipers and redeemer ;)
Ok for the framerate : I'm scared it could be an issue...

About good maps, casa abbey algiers kingdom crossing swim sanc ryiadh (and many others), I like to play on them because they are balanced, diversified enough according to my sniper/rush mood, nice-looking etc... but I don't want to compete with these maps ;)
Author:  AimMe [ 09.29.09 ]
Post subject:  Re: I'm bored. : (
Just out bomb swim in cycle!!!

Map i would like, map with big range for snipers, and very short range for automatic rushing (and knife!!!), without medium range for g36. So something like sliema (my favorite), high on buildings snipers can go, but they can shoot only snipers, they can't shoot rushers down in streets. Perfect for flanking, head to head and playing teletubies-shooting game (noobs on roof are (poorly) movable targets).
Map fro everybody, yet there are no stupid camps.

OR

Make confusion map like kingdom rc, lots of passages and holes, yet walls everywhere. Nightmare for snipers and campers, heaven for knifers. Run out of corner, jump through door, crawl through some canal, and disappear from enemy's view. Yet, you can shoot from back, or just rush in without thinking. Make few small places where sniper can shoot quite far.

My 2 cents.
Author:  SteveMcqueen [ 09.29.09 ]
Post subject:  Re: I'm bored. : (
- riyadh is about the key point:
the map is different in subtle ways, so you dont get lost on it.
the trick is, it can be a mirrored map, as long as it does not LOOK mirrored.

- a too open map is bad. if it is simple enough it may be ok (see arena2), because your fps are not fucked. but in 90% it is crap.

- i do remember the ut style maps and how they played. but this is a completely different game, changing things. thats the reason inter-game conversions are hard to make good.

- dealey is a bad arguement... you'd get much faster fed up with it than you'd believe. you just have not had the chance yet. :P

no need to rival the base maps standards'.
but take a look at them, especially:

-- what do the "choke-points" look like? that are points of initial contact after spawn / points over which people fight
-- how the spawns are created.
-- how many routes connect the spawns
-- height variations?
-- widht of hallways/doors?
-- details? or are there only straight hallways?

key design stuff is about these things, that does not take too much effort or time when you take it into consideration.
dealey has a lot effort put into design, but the scale of the map is absolutely crap. it's pure sr8 whoring will get you fed after the first 10 times you played the map. if the map was only half as big it would be WAY better, think about it.
Author:  Rylius [ 09.30.09 ]
Post subject:  Re: I'm bored. : (
Hey hey guys, thats not a thread about how to create a great map =P
As said, its learning by doing. But I ont have anything to do, so I cant learn =P
I just wanted to hear some opinions of themes/scenarios you would like to play on.
Its more about inspirational stuff than how to create ubah map. :)

Maybe I misformulated some things in the beginning, sorry :D

I think everyone has an own opinion on the maps.
I, for example, hate Riyadh. Way to open and campers everywhere, its a few units to large to do really fast rushes.

But nevertheless, thanks four your opinions, I will keep them in mind :)
Author:  SteveMcqueen [ 09.30.09 ]
Post subject:  Re: I'm bored. : (
for inspirational stuff, go and google pictures of the enviroments your maps should be in.

think about your map first, before you build ANYTHING. it will save you weeks of time and rebuilding afterwards.
same goes for clean building and using caulk from the very beginning.
but if you dont listen, go and learn the hard way. or just be a pussy and give up the first time you fuck up.

it is not about making an uber map, but preventing you from creating utter bullshit noone will ever play.
maps that are not played are not worth a single minute of the time you spent creating.

thank you for listening. :)

p.s.
no offense meant. ;)
Author:  Rylius [ 09.30.09 ]
Post subject:  Re: I'm bored. : (
Quote:
for inspirational stuff, go and google pictures of the enviroments your maps should be in.
Noooo! :lol:
THAT is really not the problem, I can easily think about nearly any situation and environment.
Also im Grunde hab ich keinen Plan, in welche Situation ich die Map machen soll. Zum Beispiel in einer Wüste wie Riyadh, eher dichte Stadt ala Casa, Turnpike usw.
Aber da es so n Krams ja irgendwo shcon gibt, bräucht ich ne Idee, dies noch net gibt und wollte mal allgemein fragen, ob jemand Ideen dafür hat.
My English sucks atm :D
Author:  SteveMcqueen [ 09.30.09 ]
Post subject:  Re: I'm bored. : (
piraten die ein schiff gekapert haben gibts denk ich nich soo oft, thementechnisch was das mappen angeht.

allgemein:
was machen denn terroristen immer so?
- bomben legen, geiseln nehmen.

wo machen die das?
- wo was teueres ist, viel kaputt geht oder viele leute sterben.
-- entweder was mit vielen menschen, wo es rohstoffe gibt, alles gerne auch in 'erste-welt-ländern'

wann ist die überlegung für dich interessant?
- wenn man mal gsg9 oder bundeswehr dazwischen schicken kann, dass die den tag retten.


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